Journals of the Senate
2nd Session, 41st Parliament
Issue 152
Monday, June 15, 2015
6:00 p.m.
The Honourable Leo Housakos, Speaker
The Members convened were:
The Honourable Senators
Andreychuk, Ataullahjan, Baker, Batters, Bellemare, Beyak, Black, Campbell, Carignan, Chaput, Cordy, Cowan, Dagenais, Dawson, Day, Downe, Doyle, Dyck, Eaton, Eggleton, Enverga, Fortin-Duplessis, Fraser, Frum, Furey, Gerstein, Greene, Hervieux-Payette, Housakos, Hubley, Jaffer, Johnson, Joyal, Lang, LeBreton, Lovelace Nicholas, MacDonald, Maltais, Manning, Marshall, Martin, Massicotte, McInnis, McIntyre, Meredith, Mitchell, Mockler, Moore, Munson, Nancy Ruth, Ngo, Ogilvie, Oh, Patterson, Plett, Poirier, Raine, Ringuette, Rivard, Runciman, Seidman, Sibbeston, Smith (Cobourg), Smith (Saurel), Stewart Olsen, Tannas, Tardif, Tkachuk, Wallace, Watt, Wells, White
The Members in attendance to business were:
The Honourable Senators
Andreychuk, Ataullahjan, Baker, Batters, Bellemare, Beyak, Black, Campbell, Carignan, Chaput, Cordy, Cowan, Dagenais, Dawson, Day, Downe, Doyle, Dyck, Eaton, Eggleton, Enverga, Fortin-Duplessis, Fraser, Frum, Furey, Gerstein, Greene, Hervieux-Payette, Housakos, Hubley, Jaffer, Johnson, Joyal, Lang, LeBreton, Lovelace Nicholas, MacDonald, Maltais, Manning, Marshall, Martin, Massicotte, McInnis, McIntyre, Meredith, Mitchell, Mockler, Moore, Munson, Nancy Ruth, Ngo, Ogilvie, Oh, Patterson, Plett, Poirier, Raine, Ringuette, Rivard, Runciman, Seidman, Sibbeston, Smith (Cobourg), Smith (Saurel), Stewart Olsen, Tannas, Tardif, Tkachuk, Wallace, Watt, Wells, White
The first list records senators present in the Senate Chamber during the course of the sitting.
An asterisk in the second list indicates a senator who, while not present during the sitting, was in attendance to business, as defined in subsections 8(2) and (3) of the Senators Attendance Policy.
PRAYERS
The Honourable the Speaker informed the Senate that a Commission under the Great Seal has been issued to Charles Robert, Clerk of the Senate and Clerk of the Parliaments, appointing him a Commissioner to administer Oath of Allegiance to Members of the Senate and also to take and receive their Declarations of Qualification.
The said Commission was then read by one of the clerks at the table, as follows:
DAVID JOHNSTON
(G.S.)
CANADA
ELIZABETH THE SECOND, by the Grace of God of the United Kingdom, Canada and Her other Realms and Territories QUEEN, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith.
WILLIAM F. PENTNEY
Deputy Attorney General
TO Charles Robert, of the City of Ottawa, in the Province of Ontario,
GREETING:
KNOW YOU that, reposing trust and confidence in your loyalty, integrity and ability, We have assigned, constituted and appointed and by these Presents do assign, constitute and appoint you,
CHARLES ROBERT
Our Commissioner to tender and administer to and take from all and every person or persons who is or are appointed a Member of the Senate of Canada the Oath of Allegiance contained in the fifth schedule to the Constitution Act, 1867, and the Declaration of Qualification contained in the same schedule.
TO HAVE AND TO HOLD the said powers and authorities unto you, Charles Robert, during Our Pleasure and your tenure of office as interim Clerk of the Senate and interim Clerk of the Parliaments.
IN TESTIMONY WHEREOF, We have caused these Our letters to be made Patent and the Great Seal of Canada to be hereunto affixed.
WITNESS:
Our Right Trusty and Well-beloved David Johnston, Chancellor and Principal Companion of Our Order of Canada, Chancellor and Commander of Our Order of Military Merit, Chancellor and Commander of Our Order of Merit of the Police Forces, Governor General and Commander-in-Chief of Canada.
AT OUR GOVERNMENT HOUSE, in Our City of Ottawa, this sixteenth day of April in the year of Our Lord two thousand and fifteen and in the sixty-fourth year of Our Reign.
BY COMMAND,
VIRGINIE ÉTHIER
Deputy Registrar General of Canada
SENATORS' STATEMENTS
Some Honourable Senators made statements.
ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS
Tabling of documents
With leave of the Senate,
The Honourable the Speaker tabled the following:
Document entitled: Senate Procedure in Practice, dated June 2015.—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1265S.
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The Honourable Senator Martin tabled the following:
The Annual Report for 2012-2013, of the Labrador Inuit Land Claims Agreement Implementation Coordinating Committee. —Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1266.
The Annual Report of the State of Inuit Culture and Society, for the year 2013-2014, respecting the Justice System in Nunavut.—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1267.
SPEAKER'S RULING
I am ready to rule on the point of order raised by the Honourable Senator Bellemare on Thursday, May 28, as to whether Bill C-377, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (requirements for labour organizations), requires a Royal Recommendation. As you will recall, the point of order was also considered by the Senate on June 9.
Senator Bellemare's concern is that Bill C-377 cannot be considered by the Senate because it appropriates public money but was not recommended to the House of Commons by the Governor General. She argued that the bill would expand the role of the Canada Revenue Agency in a way that is not envisioned by current statute. If Bill C-377 passes, the agency would be responsible for collecting and diffusing information unrelated to the protection of the tax base and compliance with tax obligations. Senator Bellemare also underscored the high costs of the measure. She also expressed concerns about the contradiction between these costs and the balanced budget requirements proposed in Bill C-59, which is currently before Parliament. As part of her argument Senator Bellemare drew a distinction between the activities of the Canada Revenue Agency relating to charitable organizations and the requirements under Bill C-377 relating to labour organizations. The agency does provide public information on charitable organizations, but Senator Bellemare argued that this role has nothing to do with the requirements that Bill C-377 would impose.
Senators Fraser, Tardif and Ringuette supported Senator Bellemare's arguments. They made reference to past rulings establishing that, unless expenditures required under a bill fit within an existing Royal Recommendation or are of an ancillary or administrative nature, the bill must be recommended to the House of Commons by the Governor General. As Senator Tardif explained, "legislation imposing additional functions on bodies funded by public money, if the functions are substantially different from their existing functions, requires a Royal Recommendation.''
Several honourable senators challenged this position. Senator Runciman provided the Senate with information from the Canada Revenue Agency indicating that the costs of Bill C-377 would be far lower than those suggested by Senator Bellemare. Both Senator Martin and Senator Dagenais drew the Senate's attention to a decision by the Speaker of the House of Commons, from December 6, 2012, in which he addressed similar points, and determined that the bill did not require a Royal Recommendation. Senator Martin argued that "a Royal Recommendation is not required every time a bill creates a new charge, but only when the charge is new and distinct.'' Senator Dagenais, for his part, explained that the provisions in the bill can actually be linked to the current mandate and operations of the Canada Revenue Agency. He also noted that witnesses from the agency had drawn connections between the requirements that Bill C-377 would impose and activities that it already undertakes.
In considering this point of order, let me first remind honourable senators that sections 53 and 54 of the Constitution Act, 1867 establish that bills to appropriate funds or to impose taxation must begin in the House of Commons and must be recommended to that house by the Governor General. This is a fundamental principle in our parliamentary system of government, generally referred to as the financial initiative of the Crown. It helps ensure a coherent fiscal structure. Decreases in taxes, on the other hand, do not require a Royal Recommendation.
We should also recognize here that the two houses do not always agree as to how this fundamental principle should be interpreted. Almost a century ago, in 1918, a Senate committee considered the issue. One of its main conclusions was that the Senate has the power to amend bills that appropriate a part of the revenue or impose a tax by reducing amounts, but it does not possess the right to increase the sums. The House of Commons has not accepted this understanding, claiming that it has exclusive rights in relation to such legislation. At times the two houses have even reached different conclusions about the need for Royal Recommendation, with the Senate sometimes determining that a bill does not require a recommendation, while the Commons determines that it does. The general pattern is for the Senate to be more flexible in interpreting these provisions, and the Commons to be more protective of its rights in relation to money bills.
Rule 10-7 specifically deals with bills appropriating public money. It states that "[t]he Senate shall not proceed with a bill appropriating public money unless the appropriation has been recommended by the Governor General.'' The issue of when a bill must be accompanied by a Royal Recommendation has been dealt with in numerous rulings in the Senate. Extracts from relevant rulings and procedural works can be found in the text relating to rule 10-7 in the second edition of the Companion to the Rules of the Senate. One of Speaker Kinsella's rulings of February 24, 2009, is particularly significant. In it he stated as follows:
The procedural authorities ... indicate that a number of criteria must be considered when seeking to ascertain whether a bill requires a Royal Recommendation. First a basic question is whether the bill contains a clause that directly appropriates money. Second, a provision allowing a novel expenditure not already authorized in law would typically require a Royal Recommendation. A third and similar criterion is that a bill to broaden the purpose of an expenditure already authorized will in most cases need a Royal Recommendation. Finally, a measure extending benefits or relaxing qualifying conditions to receive a benefit would usually bring the Royal Recommendation into play.
On the other hand, a bill simply structuring how a department or agency will perform functions already authorized under law, without adding new duties, would most likely not require a Recommendation. In the same way, a bill that would only impose minor administrative expenses on a department or agency would probably not trigger this requirement.
The list of factors enumerated here is not exhaustive, and each bill must be evaluated in light of these points and any others at play. It certainly is not the case that every bill having any monetary implication whatsoever automatically requires a Royal Recommendation. When dealing with such issues, the Speaker's role is to examine the text of the bill itself, sometimes within the context of the parent act. Of course, the Speaker, in making this assessment, seeks to avoid interpreting constitutional issues or questions of law.
In a subsequent ruling, on December 1, 2009, Speaker Kinsella clarified that a bill to add a function generally relating to an act's existing purpose and without mandating new hiring or other expenditures, does not necessarily qualify as a "new and distinct'' expenditure, and so may not require a Royal Recommendation. I should also remind senators of the general principle, expressed by several Speakers, that, when the analysis is ambiguous, the Speaker should generally prefer to presume that a matter is in order, if a valid argument to that effect can be established. This allows the Senate itself to make the final decision, preserving this chamber's role as a house of discussion and reflection.
Within this context we can turn to the specific concerns raised by Senator Bellemare. As a first point, let me note that the possible interactions of Bill C-377 with Bill C-59, if they both receive Royal Assent, are of interest, but remain hypothetical. The Speaker does not deal with hypothetical issues, so this matter need not be considered further.
In terms of the potential costs for implementing Bill C-377, the Senate has been presented with divergent estimates from two credible sources — the Parliamentary Budget Officer and the Canada Revenue Agency. We have received incompatible information, and it is impossible to reach any certain conclusion on this point.
In truth, however, the central issue in this point of order is whether Bill C-377 expands the Canada Revenue Agency's current functions. Or, to put it another way, do the agency's current responsibilities include the collection and publication of information? Senator Bellemare has argued that the agency has a mandate to protect the tax base and to ensure respect for tax obligations. The Senate has, however, been told that these are not its only duties. The Canada Revenue Agency's web site already provides extensive and detailed information about some organizations, and it may not be unreasonable to see the changes proposed under Bill C-377 as a mere adjustment to the existing activities of receiving and posting information. I also note that representatives of the Canada Revenue Agency have confirmed to senators that they are already involved in providing such information. They have also indicated that there are cases where information is disclosed for purposes not related to taxation.
As I noted earlier, the two houses respect the constitutional requirements relating to financial measures, but do not always agree on how they are to be applied. In general, the House of Commons is more demanding in interpreting these provisions, which give it pre-eminence in the financial field. It would be odd — although by no means impossible — for the Senate to find that a bill requires a Royal Recommendation when the House of Commons has determined that it does not.
Honourable senators, we are faced with varying estimates as to the costs for implementing Bill C-377. We have also been told that the provisions of the bill align with some of the work currently performed by the Canada Revenue Agency. While recognizing the importance of the concerns raised by Senator Bellemare, it does seem that these factors provide a coherent case for accepting that the bill can continue before the Senate. This conclusion is supported by, but not based on, the bill's history in the House of Commons. Mindful of the preference for allowing debate to continue when a sound argument to that effect can be made, I find the bill in order, and debate can resume.
ORDERS OF THE DAY
GOVERNMENT BUSINESS
Bills — Third Reading
Third reading of Bill C-12, An Act to amend the Corrections and Conditional Release Act.
The Honourable Senator McInnis moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Frum, that the bill be read the third time.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Campbell moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Hubley, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
° ° °
Third reading of Bill C-66, An Act for granting to Her Majesty certain sums of money for the federal public administration for the financial year ending March 31, 2016.
The Honourable Senator Smith (Saurel) moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Oh, that the bill be read the third time.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted, on division.
The bill was then read the third time and passed, on division.
Ordered, That a message be sent to the House of Commons to acquaint that House that the Senate has passed this bill.
° ° °
Third reading of Bill C-67, An Act for granting to Her Majesty certain sums of money for the federal public administration for the financial year ending March 31, 2016.
The Honourable Senator Smith (Saurel) moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Raine, that the bill be read the third time.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted, on division.
The bill was then read the third time and passed, on division.
Ordered, That a message be sent to the House of Commons to acquaint that House that the Senate has passed this bill.
Reports of Committees — Other
Orders No. 1 to 7 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Inquiries
Order No. 2 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
Other
Order No. 2 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
OTHER BUSINESS
Commons Public Bills — Third Reading
Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
° ° °
Third reading of Bill C-555, An Act respecting the Marine Mammal Regulations (seal fishery observation licence).
The Honourable Senator Doyle moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Dagenais, that the bill be read the third time.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Fraser, for the Honourable Senator Hervieux-Payette, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Hubley, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
° ° °
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Dagenais, seconded by the Honourable Senator Doyle, for the third reading of Bill C-377, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (requirements for labour organizations).
After debate,
In amendment, the Honourable Senator Bellemare moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Black, that the bill be not now read a third time but that it be amended in clause 1, on page 5,
(a) by replacing line 34 with the following:
"poration;''; and
(b) by adding after line 43 the following:
"(c) labour organizations whose labour relations activities are not within the legislative authority of Parliament;
(d) labour trusts in which no labour organization whose labour relations activities are within the legislative authority of Parliament has any legal, beneficial or financial interest; and
(e) labour trusts that are not established or maintained in whole or in part for the benefit of a labour organization whose labour relations activities are within the legislative authority of Parliament, its members or the persons it represents.''.
After debate,
The Honourable Senator Cowan moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Fraser, that further debate on the motion in amendment be adjourned until the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
MESSAGES FROM THE HOUSE OF COMMONS
A message was brought from the House of Commons with a Bill C-59, An Act to implement certain provisions of the budget tabled in Parliament on April 21, 2015 and other measures, to which it desires the concurrence of the Senate.
The bill was read the first time.
The Honourable Senator Martin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Nancy Ruth, that the bill be placed on the Orders of the Day for a second reading two days hence.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
° ° °
A message was brought from the House of Commons with a Bill C-35, An Act to amend the Criminal Code (law enforcement animals, military animals and service animals), to which it desires the concurrence of the Senate.
The bill was read the first time.
The Honourable Senator Martin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Nancy Ruth, that the bill be placed on the Orders of the Day for a second reading two days hence.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
With leave,
The Senate reverted to Presenting or Tabling Reports from Committees.
The Honourable Senator Runciman, Chair of the Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs, presented its thirty-first report (Bill C-42, An Act to amend the Firearms Act and the Criminal Code and to make a related amendment and a consequential amendment to other Acts, without amendment).
The Honourable Senator Runciman moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Beyak, that the bill be placed on the Orders of the Day for a third reading at the next sitting.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
ORDERS OF THE DAY
OTHER BUSINESS
Senate Public Bills — Reports of Committees
Orders No. 1 to 3 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Commons Public Bills — Reports of Committees
Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting.
Senate Public Bills — Second Reading
Orders No. 1 to 9 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Commons Public Bills — Second Reading
Resuming debate on the motion of the Honourable Senator Plett, seconded by the Honourable Senator Fortin- Duplessis, for the second reading of Bill C-627, An Act to amend the Railway Safety Act (safety of persons and property).
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The bill was then read the second time.
The Honourable Senator Plett moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Fortin-Duplessis, that the bill be referred to the Standing Senate Committee on Transport and Communications.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
° ° °
Orders No. 2 to 3 were called and postponed until the next sitting.
Reports of Committees — Other
Consideration of the tenth report of the Standing Senate Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Trade entitled: North American Neighbours: Maximizing Opportunities and Strengthening Cooperation for a more Prosperous Future, tabled in the Senate on June 11, 2015.
The Honourable Senator Andreychuk moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Frum:
That the tenth report of the Standing Senate Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Trade, entitled North American Neighbours: Maximizing Opportunities and Strengthening Cooperation for a More Prosperous Future, tabled in the Senate on Thursday, June 11, 2015, be adopted and that, pursuant to rule 12-24(1), the Senate requests a complete and detailed response from the government, with the Minister of Foreign Affairs being identified as the minister responsible for responding to the report, in consultation with the Minister of International Trade and the Minister of Natural Resources.
After debate,
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
The Honourable Senator Martin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stewart Olsen:
That the Senate do now adjourn.
The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.
(Accordingly, at 8:23 p.m. the Senate was continued until tomorrow at 2 p.m.)
REPORTS DEPOSITED WITH THE CLERK OF THE SENATE PURSUANT TO RULE 14-1(7):
Report of the Canada Pension Plan Investment Board, together with the Auditors' Report, for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2015, pursuant to the Canada Pension Plan Investment Board Act, S.C. 1997, c. 40, sbs. 51(2).—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1259.
Reports of the Financial Transactions and Reports Analysis Centre of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2015, pursuant to the Access to Information Act and to the Privacy Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. A-1 and P-21, sbs. 72(2).—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1260.
Summaries of the Corporate Plan for 2015-2016 to 2019-2020 and of the Operating and Capital Budgets for 2015- 2016 of the National Capital Commission, pursuant to the Financial Administration Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. F-11, sbs. 125(4).—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1261.
Report of the Transportation Safety Board of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2015, pursuant to the Canadian Transportation Accident Investigation and Safety Board Act, S.C. 1989, c. 3, sbs. 13(3).—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1262.
Reports of the Transportation Safety Board of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2015, pursuant to the Access to Information Act and to the Privacy Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. A-1 and P-21, sbs. 72(2).—Sessional Paper No. 2/41- 1263.
Summaries of the Corporate Plan for the period 2015-2016 to 2019-2020 and of the Operating and Capital Budgets of the Canadian Dairy Commission for the dairy year ending July 31, 2016, pursuant to the Financial Administration Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. F-11, sbs. 125(4).—Sessional Paper No. 2/41-1264.
Changes in Membership of Committees Pursuant to Rule 12-5
Standing Senate Committee on Human Rights
The Honourable Senator Enverga replaced the Honourable Senator Ngo (June 15, 2015).
Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs
The Honourable Senator Wells replaced the Honourable Senator Dagenais (June 15, 2015).
The Honourable Senator LeBreton, P.C., replaced the Honourable Senator McInnis (June 15, 2015).
Standing Senate Committee on National Security and Defence
The Honourable Senator Oh replaced the Honourable Senator Ngo (June 15, 2015).